differences between bus and psyke

[mallie]

This is actually quite an old thread that has recently been resurrected. If you check the early posts on it, they're about 6 months old.

I've looked at the psyke forum before, and there are differences between there and here. Personally, I think its a good thing that there are forums out there with different rules and systems, as there is more chance of people finding a community that works for them. I love bus, and find it useful for me, but that doesn't mean every SIer will agree

[silent_scream]

I like psyke and I'm a member there. I think people have given it a bad name... but I know people who have given bus a bad name also, and I still think bus is just as of supportive as it was before anyone says anything.
I use psyke and post for different reasons I might post on bus, and visa versa: and this works for me.

[sine nomine]

i think psyke fills a particular need and bus fills a different need. i respect that the boards are different, and i don't think either is bad.

deb

[Uncle_Tungsten]

but we don't encourage people to self-harm.

And neither does psyke. Please get your facts straight.
I think you have to view the psyke site and the psyke forum as seperate entities though. There are plenty of people on the forum who don't agree with the photos (you are NOT allowed to post SI photos on the forum) but realise that censorship is an evil thing so they choose not to look at the section of the site that contains the pictures.
I do agree that it's "horses for courses" though. Personally I prefer the more honest approach you get at the psyke forum. No endless posts of shmaltzy "hugz", generally just support or advice + somewhere to talk about other stuff.

[sine nomine]

by "encourage people to self-harm," i mean allowing methods posting and graphic descriptions of self-harm.

as far as psyke and wulff go, i've known wulff for 9 years or so now. we each respect the other's work, and there's no animosity there.

i'm sorry you find bus "schmaltzy". some people like hugs; others have a note in their signatures asking that no one reply with hugs. it's a personal preference thing because one man's schmaltz is another man's treasure.

if you find the rules here too restrictive, there are other, less restrictive boards out there. bus is for people in all stages of self-harm, but one of our priorities is to create an atmosphere conducive to recovery. we absolutely believe that the feelings behind a particular incident of self-harm are infinitely more important than how deep the cut was or how big the burn, or how many wounds or where they're placed.

we've all felt the uncomfortable tug of wanting to join into a competitive conversation while knowing that nothing good will come of it, so we discourage competition and graphic descriptions.

we ask people to warn others if a post is about a touchy subject because we think it's important people not be blindsided by something really difficult to deal with when they open a post. that particular rule is about courtesy more than anything else.

bus is a place where we challenge people to change their thinking and reframe situations and consider alternative ways of coping -- we want them to look at what they're doing and why. that's probably why we get people who've been referred here by therapists; we try to provide a safe, supportive environment, but we're not afraid to call bullshit if that's what's needed. if we do, though, we try to be gentle and ask questions instead of assuming we know what someone else is thinking. it's about being effective and respecting the validity of each person's feeling and ideas (even when we don't agree). we want people to learn to be effective and to ask for what they need/want.

so yeah, bus and psyke are different places, and that's okay. and if you find bus disagreeable, then there are other forums you might like better. that's why diversity is a good thing.

deb

[Uncle_Tungsten]

by "encourage people to self-harm," i mean allowing methods posting and graphic descriptions of self-harm.

If you and Wulf are so close I think he would be most upset by you continuing this scaremongering about the psyke forum.
I qoute from the psyke forum rules:

2. Do NOT post asking for methods or describing them in detail.

10. Do NOT link to or post pictures of self-inflicted wounds.

And people stick to these rules.
I would post the link but I understand you don't credit your members with the intelligence to decide whether to go there or not, and don't allow it to be posted.

[Guest]

Did the psyke rules change recently? They used to be OK with that before.

I think people are pretty restrained about psyke here. Even when there was that stupid 'invasion' or 'attack' a few months back, we were encouraged not to slag psyke off. If we post 'psyke is awful and evil and everyone there sucks', we're picked up on it. Lots of people manage to be members of both board without getting involved in silly disputes about which is better.

We don't need the link posted to find psyke, thanks, with a search engine it's very easy to do, although maybe you don't credit us with the intelligence to manage that?

[strange_indeed]

Did the psyke rules change recently? They used to be OK with that before.

They've always had those rules. Its never been allowed to ask for new methods etc just now we have a larger moderation team and its a lot easier to reinforce the rules.

[swirlish]

Maybe what deb and spoof are referring to is the Methods Forum? It seems to be gone now though. I've looked at it before and there was very very graphic posts about methods and the likes. I don't usually get triggered, but that disturbed me.

[strange_indeed]

Maybe what deb and spoof are referring to is the Methods Forum? It seems to be gone now though. I've looked at it before and there was very very graphic posts about methods and the likes. I don't usually get triggered, but that disturbed me.

Sometimes people feel so alone about self harm. Then they found a site with 5000 people doing the same thing adn it completely amazes them. Its like finding out someone has similar music taste to you when you've been shunned for it in the past, suddenly your asking "do you like this band? this album?" etc
The methods forum (unintentionally) did this sort of thing with self harm though even at its worst point "how do i do this" was always forbidden. Posts like "how often do you do it" were their and nothnig worse. The only time grapic discriptions were mentioned is when they were needed for us to give advice on how to treat the wounds. Psyke has many boards, if some are unpleasent to you it is easy to avoid them. Also what has replaced the methods board ("medical help") may to have graphic discriptions this is to HELP people who have inflicted damage on themselves help it heal properly. I see no reason why it is pro-si. To treat say a burn efficently you can't just state "I burnt myself" you haveto sya what with and how bad so people can help rather than give advice that'll make the wound worse.

[ben]

Did the psyke rules change recently? They used to be OK with that before.

They've always had those rules. Its never been allowed to ask for new methods etc just now we have a larger moderation team and its a lot easier to reinforce the rules.

Umm, no it has not, indeed those rules came in 2003/2004.

Those rules went up shortly after a series of media articles [in i think the daily mail], which were critical of internet forums in the way that only the mudroch controlled press can be.

Notwithstanding, those are the Psyke.org forum rules which were copied from here

Given the traffic between the two sites in the last 3.5 years,
which is mostly in one direction, and usually involves people coming here either to post to largely irrelevent threads like this which were started by someone who merely wanted to hear what people thought of some forum or other, in some display of defence against some form of perceived attack which just isn't there.

It's clear that you're ignorant to the fact that people from here don't go over there and cause trouble.

It's a shame that we cannot say the same for you,
but hey - y'know - the internets is beeeeg - there's plenty of room for everyone without the need to go looking for red rags that aren't really there.

But you know, all of this is meaningless at the end of the day.
If you read something looking for a fight, you'll see the inflammatory statement that you're looking for.

Links to other si forums are not permitted here, so it's not as though Psyke is being singled out for special treatment.

Not that it requires any knowledge of rocket science to run a search engine at all...

[swirlish]

Maybe what deb and spoof are referring to is the Methods Forum? It seems to be gone now though. I've looked at it before and there was very very graphic posts about methods and the likes. I don't usually get triggered, but that disturbed me.

Sometimes people feel so alone about self harm. Then they found a site with 5000 people doing the same thing adn it completely amazes them. Its like finding out someone has similar music taste to you when you've been shunned for it in the past, suddenly your asking "do you like this band? this album?" etc

Yes, but saying "I cut" and having others say "I do too" is as validating as saying "I do xxx with xxx, xx times and it bleeds x amount".

The methods forum (unintentionally) did this sort of thing with self harm though even at its worst point "how do i do this" was always forbidden. Posts like "how often do you do it" were their and nothnig worse.

Not true. I saw lots of very detailed posts about exactly what was done and how, with what etc. Obviously, I can't show you any proofs since I didn't save it.

The only time grapic discriptions were mentioned is when they were needed for us to give advice on how to treat the wounds. Psyke has many boards, if some are unpleasent to you it is easy to avoid them. Also what has replaced the methods board ("medical help") may to have graphic discriptions this is to HELP people who have inflicted damage on themselves help it heal properly. I see no reason why it is pro-si. To treat say a burn efficently you can't just state "I burnt myself" you haveto sya what with and how bad so people can help rather than give advice that'll make the wound worse.

Personally, I'm very very wary of giving medical advice. Especially over the net. If someone is worried about a cut/burn, I always urge them to seek professional medical people. I'm not educated about wound care and if I can't even see the wound? No way. I won't go there.

[strange_indeed]

Maybe what deb and spoof are referring to is the Methods Forum? It seems to be gone now though. I've looked at it before and there was very very graphic posts about methods and the likes. I don't usually get triggered, but that disturbed me.

Sometimes people feel so alone about self harm. Then they found a site with 5000 people doing the same thing adn it completely amazes them. Its like finding out someone has similar music taste to you when you've been shunned for it in the past, suddenly your asking "do you like this band? this album?" etc

Yes, but saying "I cut" and having others say "I do too" is as validating as saying "I do xxx with xxx, xx times and it bleeds x amount".

I agree with you their but i gues others don't.

The methods forum (unintentionally) did this sort of thing with self harm though even at its worst point "how do i do this" was always forbidden. Posts like "how often do you do it" were their and nothnig worse.

Not true. I saw lots of very detailed posts about exactly what was done and how, with what etc. Obviously, I can't show you any proofs since I didn't save it.

Maybe your right , I always tended to ignore that baord. I am pretty certain that "how do i do this?" has always been strictly against the rules though.

The only time grapic discriptions were mentioned is when they were needed for us to give advice on how to treat the wounds. Psyke has many boards, if some are unpleasent to you it is easy to avoid them. Also what has replaced the methods board ("medical help") may to have graphic discriptions this is to HELP people who have inflicted damage on themselves help it heal properly. I see no reason why it is pro-si. To treat say a burn efficently you can't just state "I burnt myself" you haveto sya what with and how bad so people can help rather than give advice that'll make the wound worse.

Personally, I'm very very wary of giving medical advice. Especially over the net. If someone is worried about a cut/burn, I always urge them to seek professional medical people. I'm not educated about wound care and if I can't even see the wound? No way. I won't go there.

[/quote]
We do the same, but many people for obvious reasons wont go. I see no harm in giving basic wound care advice. Its no worse than looking up first aid online. We always state that we may not be right and always advise them to see a professional. Their is a stickied post inthe self injury board giving a huge list of advice from someone who is working towards becoming medically qualified. As long as the original poster is AWARE that the advice si being given be random interent people and their word is not certain I see no harm in it personall.y

[guest11]

I actually got the impression that you misunderstood Deb there anyway... I don't think she was referring to posting pictures or asking for new methods, but instead she was referring to people posting their methods (subtle difference) and describing things graphically.

I don't like the comparison of BUS and Psyke. In my opinion, it's like trying to compare a block of cheese to a desk.

[sine nomine]

If you and Wulf are so close I think he would be most upset by you continuing this scaremongering about the psyke forum.

we're close enough that he acted immediately and firmly when some peopel fomr his board decided it would be fun to mount an "attack" on this board. he also used to mirror secret shame back in the day before he started psyke. he's aware that i run my forum differently to how he runs his, and we don't scare-monger here. we just say that bus is different to psyke, with looser rules, and we ask that people not discuss other self-harm boards here because i don't want people slagging one or the other.

I qoute from the psyke forum rules:

2. Do NOT post asking for methods or describing them in detail.

10. Do NOT link to or post pictures of self-inflicted wounds.

And people stick to these rules.

rhonda told me back around the time of the attack that they were going to start enforcing the rules. she acknowledged that the forum had gotten out of control, and that they were adding new moderators tohelp with this.

i'm not sure if you're aware of the history of the rules on psyke. they used to be very differnt to what they are, but after some problems on the board back in january 2004, they were changed and became very ismilar to the rules here.

i'm a bit confused about why you're being hostile and defensive. a lot of your language is sarcastic and invalidating, and i'm wondering why. can you help me understand what's going on with this?

deb

[strange_indeed]

The fact that psyke's *home page* has links to pages and pages of galleries of photos of self injury pretty much belies any claims to be "pro-recovery". What is their purpose, other than to glorify the act itself? The "suicide" forum is also nothing but suicide notes and melodramatic farewell gestures. How is that "pro-recovery"? The fact that the "methods" forum is gone is a good step, but is not enough to redeem the site, in my opinion. It is not a place where I will be spending my time.


Jessica

For the millionth time, Psyke forum and psyek website are differnt, it is agaisnt the rules to post pictures of self harm on the forum.
What else do you expect ot view on a suicide suppotr board? If you were to look closer a lot of them are full of careful advice that goes on for pages and pages.

[sine nomine]

strange_indeed, i noticed that you just registered here yesterday, and i am wondering if your appearance here has to do with someone having resurrected a very old thread about psyke?

if so, no one here is slagging the board. it is a different place and it has a different function. that's okay. i *really* don't want this thread to turn into an argument about which is better or how good/bad one is. there's already been some sarcastic language and harsh statements made in this thread, and i'd rather if people want to talk about this stuff they try to remain respectful of the differing opinions and interaction styles of others.

deb

[Chimera]

For anyone who wonders, I have deleted my reply to this thread. I spoke as someone who used to SI, and not as an administrator on BUS. I do not want to add fuel to the fire or antagonize anyone, and I apologise if I have done so.

Jessica

[strange_indeed]

strange_indeed, i noticed that you just registered here yesterday, and i am wondering if your appearance here has to do with someone having resurrected a very old thread about psyke?

if so, no one here is slagging the board. it is a different place and it has a different function. that's okay. i *really* don't want this thread to turn into an argument about which is better or how good/bad one is. there's already been some sarcastic language and harsh statements made in this thread, and i'd rather if people want to talk about this stuff they try to remain respectful of the differing opinions and interaction styles of others.

deb

i was a member here ages ago (differnt username) made about 40 posts but then it said I wasn't entering the right password and i asked for email and it didn't send me one and it got all messy and i just gave up (this was about a year ago I'd tell you my name then but its the same one as Pskye)
I keep meaning to signup here again... but whenver i go to read posts i never find anything i want to say really until this. So I read a lot but only signed up recently. Do not be mistaken into thinknig I wish to argue about which is better or that is the sole reason I signed up again. On the other hand it irritates me when people state incorrect facts such as we encourage self injury I've been at pskye over a year and a half and have spent a lot of time/effort there and like i said, it irritates me when its incorrect facts rather than opinion.

[sine nomine]

i was a member here ages ago (differnt username) made about 40 posts but then it said I wasn't entering the right password and i asked for email and it didn't send me one and it got all messy and i just gave up (this was about a year ago I'd tell you my name then but its the same one as Pskye)
I keep meaning to signup here again... but whenver i go to read posts i never find anything i want to say really until this. So I read a lot but only signed up recently. Do not be mistaken into thinknig I wish to argue about which is better or that is the sole reason I signed up again. On the other hand it irritates me when people state incorrect facts such as we encourage self injury I've been at pskye over a year and a half and have spent a lot of time/effort there and like i said, it irritates me when its incorrect facts rather than opinion.

i've edited this post because, although i'm not happy that you're hiding who you are and that you're participating in a thread i find to be pretty hostile toward this board, but i sholdn't have menioned as many details as i have in public, and my tone was hostile. i apologize.

deb